This Blog is a resource tool for the students taking the "FACING HISTORY AND OURSELVES" elective at Westborough High School, Westborough, Massachusetts.
Friday, September 10, 2010
PERIOD 3 - "LITTLE BOXES"
Today you read the story "Little Boxes" in class. Please share your thoughts about the story and the class discussion that followed in a reflective post. Make at least one comment about another student's post.
Mr. Gallagher
28 comments:
Sam Klefstad
said...
I thought that the overall summary of the story was that people aren't able to describe who they are by checking off a box about there ethnicity or race. But i thought the story was to an extent exaggerated because of the amount of different backrounds the kid had. It's explanation on how people are generalized into a group even if they dont belong there, was spot on and that when generalizations are made towards people they lose a part of there individuality if not all of it.
I think that the story was way to critical on the fact that there are generalizations made on paper. the generalizations are made to save space, and they arent trying to define who a person is, just get an idea, and they arent there to make people feel bad about who they are either.
I also agree with sam, and i believe that the story is an extended exaggeration, and it is clear of the authors intent and his point, but all and all i believe that it is not that big of an issue, because the boxes arent ment to allow people to judge you or make assumptions of what you are like.
I kind of feel like Anthony was over analyzing the box thing. He could have checked more than one for ethnicity if he had multiple, etc. Also, there's no way everything about you can be categorized into selectable boxes. Thoughts and feelings are identity, too, and there aren't boxes for that. If you are filling something out, the boxes you are given are not necessarily everything you are.
I thought that the overall message of the story was that people aren’t able to describe themselves as simply as checking off little boxes. In my opinion this is to get a general idea of a person, not to know exactly what that person is like. I agree with what Meredith said about not being able to categorize everything into selectable boxes.
I agree with the author, I think people are often pushed into certain categories by what there race is. In my opinion race is pretty insignificant and only distinguishes people very slightly. It shouldn't have any connection with your personality or anything else. People are often stereotyped and labeled because of the race they are,which takes away from everyone's individuality.
Anthony was faced with the challenge of describing himself in nothing else but a box. Even though I completely agree that no one can be generalized down to a few words or phrases, but in mass applications or such things like that this is the only way to eliminate or even determine certain people. Without a quick way to scan through applications, businesses and colleges would be forced to interview thousands of kids and no one has time for that. But I completely agree with Gabe. I understand that campuses are trying to diversify but making you check off your race, but depending on who is reading your application this can sometimes turn against someone.
I thought the story did a pretty good job of proving the point that a "little box" cannot describe someone's race or identity. I believe that by checking off a box you are only revealing a tiny bit of information about you and not what is really important. Someone who could be reviewing something like a college or job application could stereotype someone for being African American. By doing this they are judging someone they do not even know simply by their race, which is not right.
I agree with Gabe because it is not right to stereotype people based on their race. I also agree that by stereotyping someone you cannot see his or her true personality. Anyone who is reading job applications could place a stereotype on someone of a different race causing them to not get the job even though they may be a positive person.
I think that the "Little Boxes" article had a good point to it. A persons identity cannot be classified with just a few boxes with general questions. However I do believe that the writer was over analyzing the issue. With things like job applications or college applications, people just want an overview of who the person filling out the application is. It would be hard going into much more depth when someone part of college admissions for example, has to go through thousands. I believe that people going through this surveys or applications would know that there was more to the person than just the filled in boxes.
In response to Meredith's comment.. I definatly agree with what Meredith has to say. I think people understand that someones full identity wont be revealed in that one application along with their thoughts and feelings. But like Meredith said, I also agree how the author seemed to be over analyzing the situation.
I believe that the story had its points on generalization, but the fact that we use generalizations all the time in our lives it’s not as if you can be too critical on the subject like the author was. Maybe people lose their individuality when the group uses these generalizations to group individuals, but it’s not as if the group overall is not individualistic within itself.
I think that Anthony's dilemma is an unfortunate one, but not as big of a deal as he makes it out to be. Obviously nobody wants to be overly generalized into a group that they may not completely belong in or that they don't want to be placed in, but it's not the end of the world. Being both Irish and Arabic I understand where he is coming from. When it comes to boxes I always put white because being 3rd generation I'm more American than anything. While I'm not always satisfied with the generalized "white" title, it's not something I lose sleep over.
I agree with both Kelsey and Meredith in that if Anthony really wanted to he could have checked more than one box. I also agree that there are other parts to applications and the boxes aren't nearly as important as he makes them out to be.
I do agree with what Sam is trying to say toward generalizations into groups as well as towards people in general. What the author was trying to ssay is that overtime he began to realize that no one can place him into a "little box" or determine his identity it is up to you to realize who you are and who you want to be.
I think Anothy's problem clearly demonstrates the pitfalls of categorizing and generalizing people. By making a person chose a group to be associated with, you believe you are learning about a person without even knowing them. In reality, the generalizations of a group may not say enough about a person's identity, or they may say something about a person's identity which isn't true. Anthony doesn't face this though because he doesn't fit into categories that are presented to him. As a result people might not feel so confortable with him at first, not being able to make assumptions about him based on his identity, but he will also avoid being put into categories that don't necessarily desccribe who he really is.
Meredith's comment about generalizations seems to build on what I said about how generalizations of a group might not summarize fully who a person is. I definately agree that your actual thoughts and emotions are a major part of identity as well as what you have actually done in your life, not just what people like you have done.
I thought that “Little Boxes” was a good way of saying someone’s identity can not be determined or summed up with just the few options given on applications. Someone with a background as different Anthony’s could run into the same problems because they may feel like they must hide their identity by checking off “other” or leave parts of themselves behind because they are just simply not and option.
I do agree with Meredith because I think these boxes are a way to find a generalization and not get to know each and every person on a personal level.
For Connors post... I think that there are some people who can describe themselves by checking off a box. But those people aren't independent enough to realize that everyone shouldnt be generalized by checking off a box.
I agree with Wright when he says that people "cannot and don't deserve to be generalized or classified." Every human being is unique and has their own qualities that make them an individual. When people start labeling each other, issues with identity begin to arise. Some believe that just because they've been labeled, or been associated with some group of people, they have to conform to the group's actions, behavior, beliefs, etc. That isn't true. Being an individual means being able to be as different as you want and not worrying about whether or not someone agrees with YOUR idea of you. Often, because of things like the application forms Wright mentioned, we’re forced to choose what we want to be labeled as. However, just because we check that one box (that applies the most) on the form, doesn’t mean that we belong only under that one label. We’re free to be individuals - whether or not there are labels.
I believe that Anthony rises a good point when he says that "I cannot and don't deserve to be generalized or classified, just like anybody else." No one should have to feel limited when they are being thought about just based on generalizations or stereotypes. At the same time i do believe that people are hurt by the fact that their membership in a group is not acknowledged by other people. Although if people do make generalization about a person it is up to them to prove them wrong and stay true to their own identity.
In response to Trevor's comment I can see how you are not fully satisfied with checking off "white" and unlike Anthony, i agree with how you don't dwell on it because you know your true identity.
In response to Mike Doran’s post: I agree. Stereotypes are a huge part of labels!! Often, people are pushed into being labeled a certain way because of a lack of a better term. Yes, the label may reveal a small part of who you are, but the true you is barely represented by the label (basically what Mike said). Often, the labels don’t encompass the whole person inside.
I agree with the author in that people are easily labeled by what they appear to look like. I agree with Gabe because stereotypes exsist everywhere and people shouldn't be labeled simply by what race they are. People can't express who they really are on a job application by checking one of the "little boxes." Whether it be White or Latino, someone can't show where they are really from.
I believe that the author of "Little Boxes" had valid points in many ways but seemed to over-analyze the situation at times. I agree that the boxes are often too vague and can be an attempt to group people into a certain stereotypes which is unfair and unjust. However, the boxes are not meant to define ones' identity. Although one might check a certain box for ethnicity and religion, they are not expected to solely associate with those that also chose those boxes. America is the melting pot of cultures and the boxes are often used to ensure that the location remains diversified.
I agree with Shady at the same time however. Although the boxes are meant to have a positive purpose, they could also have a negative affect. Somebody with prejudice tendencies reviewing an application completed by an applicant of a different race may scrutinize that application more than another. It is one of the dangers of generalization.
I thought that this essay portrays why generalizing can really limit a person. No one wants to be accepted just because their ethinicty fit what they where lacking, and when your too much of the same so your not accepted is also difficult.
Response to Brian, yes it could be seen as over analyzed but i would be this upset and conserned if i could possibly be declined from something for checking a box that is not wanted.
I tihnk that Anthony was over analyzing it. The boxes are there so that work places and schools can have a diverse enviorment. Ifn anything it helped Anthony think about his identity and come to a conclusion on what he's most comfortable being aknowledged as.
I think that Anthony was correct in saying that sometimes people generalize other people way too much but I also think that in some ways he is correct in that people should respect different people's background.
I agree with Sam Klefstad in that he exagerrated his point and that he took it a little too far.
Something that hasn't been addressed here is the difference between what an individual feels and what society see's. If race had no factor in identity it wouldn't be asked. But most often being part of a race means being part of a culture.A black person isn't "black" because they have dark skin, they are black because they presume to have some experience, perspective, and background that is similar to everyone else who is black. Some "black" people are part of white culture and some "white" people have could be said to be part of black culture. For many people race is a very key component to identity. In response to the various people who said it doesn't matter you should realize that what you are saying is "it doesn't matter to me." Nobody has a right to tell anyone that they shouldn't find by their racial heritage important.
Anthony is talking about how he doesn't fit into a clearly defined category. Despite what Gabe says he never said that nobody should consider themselves to be within a category, or that it shouldn't play a role in who you are as a person. It seems like a lot of people think he was dismissing the significance of racial identity. I think he was just pointing out the complexity of it. Your ethnicity may be a factor, you may be part of another ethnicities culture, you may not see yourself as part of any culture. That's why the boxes trap him. It's not that they are presuming something insignificant needs to be known.
Anthony's point was to show that a little box doesn't provide enough detail to describe someone in their entirety. Having said that, I do believe with Meredith in that Anthony was being a little too critical about the boxes. They are used as a tool to quickly give someone an idea about who you are. They don't have to know every detail about you.
I think the author made a very valid point about people not being able to just be checked off in a box due to heritage. Just because something is from a certain doesn't mean that they are going to be a certain person. Everyone is their own person and has their own set of beliefs, and a box can't determine those. I also agree with Owen that a person's background should be respected.
28 comments:
I thought that the overall summary of the story was that people aren't able to describe who they are by checking off a box about there ethnicity or race. But i thought the story was to an extent exaggerated because of the amount of different backrounds the kid had. It's explanation on how people are generalized into a group even if they dont belong there, was spot on and that when generalizations are made towards people they lose a part of there individuality if not all of it.
I think that the story was way to critical on the fact that there are generalizations made on paper. the generalizations are made to save space, and they arent trying to define who a person is, just get an idea, and they arent there to make people feel bad about who they are either.
I also agree with sam, and i believe that the story is an extended exaggeration, and it is clear of the authors intent and his point, but all and all i believe that it is not that big of an issue, because the boxes arent ment to allow people to judge you or make assumptions of what you are like.
I kind of feel like Anthony was over analyzing the box thing. He could have checked more than one for ethnicity if he had multiple, etc. Also, there's no way everything about you can be categorized into selectable boxes. Thoughts and feelings are identity, too, and there aren't boxes for that. If you are filling something out, the boxes you are given are not necessarily everything you are.
I agree with you Sam, as your explanation of the story is kind of what I'm trying to say too.
I thought that the overall message of the story was that people aren’t able to describe themselves as simply as checking off little boxes. In my opinion this is to get a general idea of a person, not to know exactly what that person is like. I agree with what Meredith said about not being able to categorize everything into selectable boxes.
I agree with the author, I think people are often pushed into certain categories by what there race is. In my opinion race is pretty insignificant and only distinguishes people very slightly. It shouldn't have any connection with your personality or anything else. People are often stereotyped and labeled because of the race they are,which takes away from everyone's individuality.
Anthony was faced with the challenge of describing himself in nothing else but a box. Even though I completely agree that no one can be generalized down to a few words or phrases, but in mass applications or such things like that this is the only way to eliminate or even determine certain people. Without a quick way to scan through applications, businesses and colleges would be forced to interview thousands of kids and no one has time for that. But I completely agree with Gabe. I understand that campuses are trying to diversify but making you check off your race, but depending on who is reading your application this can sometimes turn against someone.
I thought the story did a pretty good job of proving the point that a "little box" cannot describe someone's race or identity. I believe that by checking off a box you are only revealing a tiny bit of information about you and not what is really important. Someone who could be reviewing something like a college or job application could stereotype someone for being African American. By doing this they are judging someone they do not even know simply by their race, which is not right.
I agree with Gabe because it is not right to stereotype people based on their race. I also agree that by stereotyping someone you cannot see his or her true personality. Anyone who is reading job applications could place a stereotype on someone of a different race causing them to not get the job even though they may be a positive person.
I think that the "Little Boxes" article had a good point to it. A persons identity cannot be classified with just a few boxes with general questions. However I do believe that the writer was over analyzing the issue. With things like job applications or college applications, people just want an overview of who the person filling out the application is. It would be hard going into much more depth when someone part of college admissions for example, has to go through thousands. I believe that people going through this surveys or applications would know that there was more to the person than just the filled in boxes.
In response to Meredith's comment.. I definatly agree with what Meredith has to say. I think people understand that someones full identity wont be revealed in that one application along with their thoughts and feelings. But like Meredith said, I also agree how the author seemed to be over analyzing the situation.
I believe that the story had its points on generalization, but the fact that we use generalizations all the time in our lives it’s not as if you can be too critical on the subject like the author was. Maybe people lose their individuality when the group uses these generalizations to group individuals, but it’s not as if the group overall is not individualistic within itself.
I think that Anthony's dilemma is an unfortunate one, but not as big of a deal as he makes it out to be. Obviously nobody wants to be overly generalized into a group that they may not completely belong in or that they don't want to be placed in, but it's not the end of the world. Being both Irish and Arabic I understand where he is coming from. When it comes to boxes I always put white because being 3rd generation I'm more American than anything. While I'm not always satisfied with the generalized "white" title, it's not something I lose sleep over.
I agree with both Kelsey and Meredith in that if Anthony really wanted to he could have checked more than one box. I also agree that there are other parts to applications and the boxes aren't nearly as important as he makes them out to be.
I do agree with what Sam is trying to say toward generalizations into groups as well as towards people in general. What the author was trying to ssay is that overtime he began to realize that no one can place him into a "little box" or determine his identity it is up to you to realize who you are and who you want to be.
I think Anothy's problem clearly demonstrates the pitfalls of categorizing and generalizing people. By making a person chose a group to be associated with, you believe you are learning about a person without even knowing them. In reality, the generalizations of a group may not say enough about a person's identity, or they may say something about a person's identity which isn't true. Anthony doesn't face this though because he doesn't fit into categories that are presented to him. As a result people might not feel so confortable with him at first, not being able to make assumptions about him based on his identity, but he will also avoid being put into categories that don't necessarily desccribe who he really is.
Meredith's comment about generalizations seems to build on what I said about how generalizations of a group might not summarize fully who a person is. I definately agree that your actual thoughts and emotions are a major part of identity as well as what you have actually done in your life, not just what people like you have done.
I thought that “Little Boxes” was a good way of saying someone’s identity can not be determined or summed up with just the few options given on applications. Someone with a background as different Anthony’s could run into the same problems because they may feel like they must hide their identity by checking off “other” or leave parts of themselves behind because they are just simply not and option.
I do agree with Meredith because I think these boxes are a way to find a generalization and not get to know each and every person on a personal level.
For Connors post... I think that there are some people who can describe themselves by checking off a box. But those people aren't independent enough to realize that everyone shouldnt be generalized by checking off a box.
I agree with Wright when he says that people "cannot and don't deserve to be generalized or classified." Every human being is unique and has their own qualities that make them an individual. When people start labeling each other, issues with identity begin to arise. Some believe that just because they've been labeled, or been associated with some group of people, they have to conform to the group's actions, behavior, beliefs, etc. That isn't true. Being an individual means being able to be as different as you want and not worrying about whether or not someone agrees with YOUR idea of you. Often, because of things like the application forms Wright mentioned, we’re forced to choose what we want to be labeled as. However, just because we check that one box (that applies the most) on the form, doesn’t mean that we belong only under that one label. We’re free to be individuals - whether or not there are labels.
I believe that Anthony rises a good point when he says that "I cannot and don't deserve to be generalized or classified, just like anybody else." No one should have to feel limited when they are being thought about just based on generalizations or stereotypes. At the same time i do believe that people are hurt by the fact that their membership in a group is not acknowledged by other people. Although if people do make generalization about a person it is up to them to prove them wrong and stay true to their own identity.
In response to Trevor's comment I can see how you are not fully satisfied with checking off "white" and unlike Anthony, i agree with how you don't dwell on it because you know your true identity.
In response to Mike Doran’s post: I agree. Stereotypes are a huge part of labels!! Often, people are pushed into being labeled a certain way because of a lack of a better term. Yes, the label may reveal a small part of who you are, but the true you is barely represented by the label (basically what Mike said). Often, the labels don’t encompass the whole person inside.
I agree with the author in that people are easily labeled by what they appear to look like. I agree with Gabe because stereotypes exsist everywhere and people shouldn't be labeled simply by what race they are. People can't express who they really are on a job application by checking one of the "little boxes." Whether it be White or Latino, someone can't show where they are really from.
I believe that the author of "Little Boxes" had valid points in many ways but seemed to over-analyze the situation at times. I agree that the boxes are often too vague and can be an attempt to group people into a certain stereotypes which is unfair and unjust. However, the boxes are not meant to define ones' identity. Although one might check a certain box for ethnicity and religion, they are not expected to solely associate with those that also chose those boxes. America is the melting pot of cultures and the boxes are often used to ensure that the location remains diversified.
I agree with Shady at the same time however. Although the boxes are meant to have a positive purpose, they could also have a negative affect. Somebody with prejudice tendencies reviewing an application completed by an applicant of a different race may scrutinize that application more than another. It is one of the dangers of generalization.
I thought that this essay portrays why generalizing can really limit a person. No one wants to be accepted just because their ethinicty fit what they where lacking, and when your too much of the same so your not accepted is also difficult.
Response to Brian, yes it could be seen as over analyzed but i would be this upset and conserned if i could possibly be declined from something for checking a box that is not wanted.
I tihnk that Anthony was over analyzing it. The boxes are there so that work places and schools can have a diverse enviorment. Ifn anything it helped Anthony think about his identity and come to a conclusion on what he's most comfortable being aknowledged as.
I think that Anthony was correct in saying that sometimes people generalize other people way too much but I also think that in some ways he is correct in that people should respect different people's background.
I agree with Sam Klefstad in that he exagerrated his point and that he took it a little too far.
Something that hasn't been addressed here is the difference between what an individual feels and what society see's. If race had no factor in identity it wouldn't be asked. But most often being part of a race means being part of a culture.A black person isn't "black" because they have dark skin, they are black because they presume to have some experience, perspective, and background that is similar to everyone else who is black. Some "black" people are part of white culture and some "white" people have could be said to be part of black culture. For many people race is a very key component to identity. In response to the various people who said it doesn't matter you should realize that what you are saying is "it doesn't matter to me." Nobody has a right to tell anyone that they shouldn't find by their racial heritage important.
Anthony is talking about how he doesn't fit into a clearly defined category. Despite what Gabe says he never said that nobody should consider themselves to be within a category, or that it shouldn't play a role in who you are as a person. It seems like a lot of people think he was dismissing the significance of racial identity. I think he was just pointing out the complexity of it. Your ethnicity may be a factor, you may be part of another ethnicities culture, you may not see yourself as part of any culture. That's why the boxes trap him. It's not that they are presuming something insignificant needs to be known.
Anthony's point was to show that a little box doesn't provide enough detail to describe someone in their entirety. Having said that, I do believe with Meredith in that Anthony was being a little too critical about the boxes. They are used as a tool to quickly give someone an idea about who you are. They don't have to know every detail about you.
I think the author made a very valid point about people not being able to just be checked off in a box due to heritage. Just because something is from a certain doesn't mean that they are going to be a certain person. Everyone is their own person and has their own set of beliefs, and a box can't determine those. I also agree with Owen that a person's background should be respected.
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